Kojima’s new game will use a third party engine

During the Q&A session with Kojima at the Nordic Game convention, the question came up if Kojima is planning to use in house technology for his next game, as he has done in the past, or use a licensed engine this time around. Kojima answered (through his translator):

I actually think it’s better to use those internal tools, and making a game with internal tools. As for my first title – because I want to release it to the people who are waiting for it – so for that title we are going to use a third party engine. The reason why I’m traveling around the world is also to look for such technology to use.

Kojima-at-Nordic-Game-Still

Kojima has visited many gaming studios across the world the past few months, from Sony World Wide Studios to DICE just recently. He has been exceptionally positive about the balance between technology, people and vision at Media Molecule and DICE.

During the interview he also reaffirmed that he’s planning to make a big game like the ones we’ve come to expect from him, but with a smaller team. He wants to release this title ‘as soon as possible’, but can’t say yet when this will be.

Furthermore, he talked about how he’s able to combine realism with fantastical elements. Kojima explained that what is important to him is to make the player feel immersed in the world, rather than make the world feel as realistic as possible. To achieve this, every small thing in the game has to be consistent in creating this feeling of being inside its world. This is why Kojima places a lot of importance on attention to detail. As an example he used the theme park Disneyland. You are inside this world, and even the bathrooms aren’t regular bathrooms but made to fit in this universe, and because of this you aren’t pulled from the illusion of being in this world. In the same way, when making a game, the small details have to match the overall world of the game.

Kojima also talked a bit about the recently revealed render of the Kojima Productions icon, and what it stands for.

I wanted to indicate the way that Kojima Productions directs, and to show something as concrete as this visual. This one is equipped with the most advanced technology and it’s a soldier going to adventure with a pioneer spirit, and the intention is like: he entered a world that you never saw before, you never played before.

Kojima added that the character isn’t equipped for war, but to face the many difficulties that may lie ahead.

Kojima-Productions-Ludens

You can watch the full Q&A session here.

"Thank you very much."
“Thank you very much.”

Source: Hideo Kojima LIVE from Nordic Game 2016

  • Aleezy

    “This one is equipped….” Meaning more kinds of soldiers?

    A space exploration maybe? Maybe going into a variety of worlds with creative, colorful environments?

    I’m in.

    • It’s probably just an awkward translation, the point seems to be that the character (Ludens) is more of an explorer than a warrior.

      • Biggy

        I like that yo exactly What i like about the characters he makes

  • Full Options

    Thanks, a real Nectar ! With his science of detail, he gives the feeling of a “George Lucas” of video games. He sound really motivated and careful about fans expectations. I appreciated the precision about the size of the game.. Pretty straight to the point !
    Can’t wait any other slightest info ! 😀

    • Leguywhodrownedquiet

      Irvin Kershner>George Lucas>Jar Jar Abrams

      • Full Options

        😀 You are rude with JJ, he is a great producer despite all.

        • Leguywhodrownedquiet

          I don’t like JJ and his contribution to SW -_-

          • Full Options

            I understand although SW is an extremely sensible franchise to manipulate. The major difference between the first (4/5/6) the 2 last trilogies is that “A new hope” and “Empire strikes back” were produced with less planning for the next opus(es).
            When Mc Callum produced the 1/2/3, all 3 episodes were clearly planned to be produced so it drastically impacted many aspects. JJ is now having more pressures from everywhere due to the accumulated success of all previous opuses because his trilogy is the last one. But I still think he did quite great/ok with SW7 and hope he’ll do something great for the next ones.

            His Star-Trek adaptations as a producer are real gems for me.

  • Kol Leqejza

    isn’t the fox engine considered to be a third-party engine? just buy the license. can’t stand another game that features the unreal engine.

    • Lamp123

      That would depend if Konami plan to license the fox engine to other developers. From the looks of it they are not.

      • They were planning to do that initially but it doesn’t seem like they are now. A bit of a shame to let a great engine like that go to waste.

        • Full Options

          I don’t remember well, but I think I read somewhere that Kojima was planning it. He perhaps might have also considered sharing it “sand-box” / editor style (if not open) like CryEngine before they went fully open. A big waste for the game dev community indeed. There are various levels of waste, let’s hope a cool or at least decent MGS6 !

        • César H. Sandoval

          It’s the PES engine now, such is the fate of mortals…

    • Full Options

      Unreal can be the base for awesome games. All depends on the capacity of the team to master the code base enough for creating proper derivations of the default gameplay components.

      This is what takes time. If you use UE4 just out-of-box, you may deliver the feeling you are describing, common glitches that makes you recognize the engine through different titles. Although Epic is constantly improving / fixing tons of stuff thanks to the big community using Unreal.

      On the other hand, if you take the time to re-write / adapt part(s) of the engine you get closer to the goal of delivering a unique experience. The question becomes then how much time you have to spend in such customization (and how much perfectionist you are btw ;D).

      Unreal could be a good basis like CryEngine or FoxEngine. All those recent engines provide pretty robust / performing graphics engine and pretty solid asset pipelines strategies. This allows the devs to more directly tap in their projects.

      Writing all this from scratch would take ages in R&D and according testing. In all cases most “good” dev studios using a 3rd party solution often heavily customize / optimize some core components in order to reach suitable frame budget profiles, really tailoring the engine around specific scenes / levels.

  • Biggy

    Where is the interview???

    • You mean the video? There is a link just below the Ludens image.

      • Biggy

        Thanks I didn’t find it first out of desperation hahaha

  • Leguywhodrownedquiet

    Naughty dog engine lmao?

    • Full Options

      Why not, Naughty Dog is a Sony first party studio since 2001. He will perhaps visit them too at some point ? 😀

    • Aleezy

      After playing u4? I sure hope so.

    • JJBYACHFullOptions2FucKonami

      I would prefer if they use Unreal 4 – Naughty Dog’s engines seem to be tailored so specifically to the games they make.

      • Leguywhodrownedquiet

        Well yeah

  • JJBYACHFullOptions2FucKonami

    Thanks for the summary Nyx – I missed the talk, so this saved me a lot of time.

    • They talked about some other stuff as well, so check out the video if you want to hear about that. Unfortunately the translator is kind of hard to understand at times.

      • Full Options

        I felt so embarrassed for her at some points in the talk.. Probably an emergency translator… It was just like someone sneezed on our microscope’s lenses. xD
        Poor Oka-San, we can not expect her to twanslatu that hard so techy stuff. She did well after all.

  • Gatsu

    This was interesting to read, thanks a lot Boss :D.

  • He will not use Unreal Engine 4. The fact that he left the Nordic Game conference so early says a lot about it. Nordic Game has a nice exhibition for UE devs but Kojima just left and that’s it.

    I think he will use an Internal Sony’s technology. Something that is easy to develop, easy to tweak for it’s own purposes. Can’t say what it is. But I hope that it is nice.

    • Full Options

      PhyreEngine is built by SCEE. It is also integrated in the PS-SDK. Although it is pretty native and quite hard to manipulate if compared to CryEngine or Unreal (you need a bit more programming). It is extremely well performing and multiplat, but he’ll definitely need Sony’s help or at least guys very familiar with it if he decide to choose it.

      • Lewis

        The only game for PS4 using PhyreEngine is Unravel, if I’ve done my “research” correctly. Will it be enough for Kojima Productions’ demands?

        • Full Options

          You probably did your “research” correctly. 😀 However you may struggle in clearly finding other ones, because the PhyreEngine is open source so many studios just rip it (while fine-tuning it for their needs) for years now since the licence does not even oblige the user to mention them. They are just stating that greetings in the credits are not mandatory but would be appreciated.
          😉
          PhyreEngine, first known as the PlayStation Scene Graph (or PSSG, before firmware 1.5 or something..) is the main Sony’s proprietary PlayStation SDK’s engine. It is multiplat but primarily developed for the PlayStation3, PlayStation4 and PSP / VITA targets.

          “Will it be enough for Kojima Productions’ demands?” That depends on how much skilled C++ developers you put on it. It also heavily depend on the type of gameplay you need to implement, however at that strong levels of programming skills, all the engines become more or less the same. You have to write down tweaks in C++ and sometimes use SIMD intrinsics or ASM to optimize the most processing-consuming tasks.

          • Lewis

            Thank you for insight, rather interesting information. If you don’t mind me asking, are you a programmer of some sorts?

          • Full Options

            My pleasure Lewis. Yes, a bit more than for 15 years or something through various languages, and no problem about asking.
            I first started as a pre-rendered 3D graphist in the early 90’s and slowly switched to write plugins for 3D studio and maya later on. I created a first digital content creation studio with a friend in 1995, mainly producing short movie-clips.
            In 2009, I registered a company a bit more specialized in development, doing either code or consulting in various fields.

            My studio got the authorization to develop on PSP and PS3 in 2011, after applying and being accepted by the SCEE third party developer program.
            I also participated in debugging Phyre through exchange of various support and sometime fixes with their team, either in their samples, DCC exporters and few other components.
            I did not asked for the PS4 authorization yet. I had to go back to work in IT in order to keep my studio open, so doing a little less low-level language stuff for the moment.
            Just few consultancies here and there, but for sure still studying various game techs whenever I am not too tired.
            I did not manage to pull out my game yet. Hopefully some day if I am lucky enough / have enough time. 😉

          • Lewis

            Wow, that’s…incredible. By brother and I are planning to open a studio to develop games, so every bit of info you gave me was precious. I don’t know if it is appropriate (if not, you’ll have to forgive me :D), but can I add you anywhere, where it is possible to chat 1v1? It may be anything, if you don’t want to share personal info (which is quite understandable). I ask this, cause due to our near zero experience in such things (along with gamedev being very poor in our country) every bit of advice can provide immense help. Hope my request won’t offend you. 🙂

          • Full Options

            All is appropriate and not offending at all / relax. I will be more than glad to possibly avoid you wrong directions if I can. First, I would say that you guys DO NOT register your company before properly planning your game project.

            You can stabilize a little prototype on PC and trust me on this, porting it to AAA hardware like PlayStation is really secondary and less complicated than it seems, as far as you guys stay neat and try to understand / master what you are doing rather than accumulating sloppy fixes (and move on because it simply works rather than understanding why).
            Once you’ll have isolated a rocking level design workflow, you’ll have more material to focus on deploying towards more targets.
            The more you keep it all neat the less effort you’ll have to deploy everywhere.

            You also have to identify your target platforms according to your idea.
            You guys can prototype things like pigs no pb (that’s called R&D, :D), but try to stay as compact as possible everywhere, for what you’ll finally decide to keep in the box. It won’t save you time at first glance, but surely will in the long run (like months).

            It is hard for me to brainstorm on a tech without knowing which type of gameplay you guys would like to implement, also because I have various opinions and do not want to put you on wrong tracks, so just drop a line or let me know which 1v1 chat standard you’d prefer. I will just let you know if I can’t answer some questions because of legal or privacy concerns, no worries.

  • ADAMJENSEN13

    Off topic,
    I know its kinda late but I just watched P.T demo for the first time!
    WOW! That was awesome! Too bad it was cancelled. Looked fantastic! I played only Silent Hill 3 to hopsital moment and it was really bad game I would say. Kojima Silent Hills could be first good Silent Hill game. Gameplay looked amazing!!!! and it was just a teaser demo. I hope Hideo Kojima someday would think about making a horror game again.

    • Full Options

      Just stay tuned.. ;D

    • Lewis

      >I played only Silent Hill 3 to hospital moment
      >Kojima Silent Hills could be first good Silent Hill game

      I’m speechless. After reading those lines multiple time I can’t even find a proper insult for you. Ignorace overload, mission abort.

      • Leguywhodrownedquiet

        I didn’t play SH 3 at all and you’re being really rude -_-
        You should respect his opinion
        However the silent hills statement is a pretty dumbass opinion imo
        Also the first two were masterpieces

        • Lewis

          What opinion? An opinion about a series of games, he didn’t even play? And I’m not a fanboy of SH, I never played one (dunno how, but really regret it now), and I still can’t find a proper word for a person, who says a series is bad, having only played one game (not the best, afaik, and not till the end).

          I respect opinions, if people can form and express them well. I don’t even care if he didn’t like SH3, that is an opinion: he tried the game, he didn’t like it. But dismissing every game in a fan favourite, cult classic series – that is not an opinion.

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            Yeahp

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Yes, I didnt play Silnet 1,2 but 3 is really bad. So how 1,2 can be so great? Tell me if You know answer?
            Its the same game right? The same developer, right? Gameplay couldnt change soo much that it is soooo horrible now and was masterpiece.
            Gameplay is the most important thing in the game and gameplay in Sh3 is bad!
            I heard that guns in secondSH was useless too. Just run through enemies never figthing. Just running. Stupid!

          • Gatsu

            The story of SH2 is awesome. I like it in all of the 3. After 3 the series started to go downhill imo

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            I dont like fighting enemies in horror games too but I think there are too much of them in SH3. It would be good if there would two of them in one place but there are bunch of them in one small room. Project Zero Camera works much better.

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            I didn’t like 3’s story

          • Lewis

            You didn’t play them – you can’t say they are bad. That is pure ignorance and stupidity. There are lots of sequels gone wrong, and every entry in the series can be good and bad. Yeah, probably, if you didn’t like SH3, you may (MAY, not 100% sure) not like SH1 and SH2. But you can’t just ride on your fucking high horse and throw something like “I didn’t play it, but it was bad. Let Kojima save everyone.”

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            You are right.
            But take other games for example. Like Assassins Creed. 1st game is good adventure game but stealth sucks. 2nd is good adventure too but stealth sucks too. 3rd game is really good adventure game but stealth is mega shitty. So I dont think AC Syndicate stealth can be good.
            Lets take Final Fantasy. FF7-9 are the same in gameplay. Graphic improved but gameplay is the same. They are fantastic RPG but gameplay is the same!
            Skate too. First game is the best but 3rd sucks. But mechanism of the gameplay is the same. Animation is worse, graphic too but You play it the same way!
            You are right. I cant judge games I didnt play. That is just my predictions from my experience with the games. If SH3 is bad there a big chance other are as well. It would be different case if SH3 was for example made by konami and SH4 by…hmm… Capcom. It for sure Capcom game would be better. Old Resident games are much better than SH and SH is a copy of Resident in every way! Like menu and sounds.

            FF13 is Fantastic game because gameplay is the most important thing and FF13 have one of the best battle system of all RPG but its linear so everyone hates it.
            And Silent hill games last years wasnt the best from looking at gameplay.
            Dont You think it would be great if Kojima would save Silent Hill? 🙂

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            The only Silent Hill im interested now is Silent Hill Shattered memories for PSP and Wii. That game looks really good. Probably because not looking like Silnet so maybe thats why I think its good.

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            shatttered memories is a remake of the first one

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Really? You played it? Shattered memories looks really good. I prefer how camera works in this one instead of 1-4 Silent Hill and it looks more scary.
            No matter what gameplay I saw there wasnt a monster anywhere which is a big plus for me.

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            Nope didn’t play it
            There aren’t monsters in SH 1
            Pyramid head is amazing in SH2

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            For real? No monsters?! Are You sure? Thats fantastic news! Maybe I was too haste saying all Silent Hill are bad. Sorry! 🙂
            If I will have chance I will play it for sure.
            Yeah. Pyramid Head design is Fantastic.

            I really like the movie Silent Hill. Nice horror.

        • ADAMJENSEN13

          If You didnt played Silent Hill 3 then please, never play it! 🙂
          Gameplay is very bad!

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            I don’t like the story but the series is amazing
            Silent 1 and 2 were masterpieces

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            How was gameplay? Shooting, exploration etc
            In SH3 those thing are very bad!
            How it was in 1,2?

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            Sh1 doesn’t even have guns.
            Nor is it third person

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Really? Good to hear it. Guns are really useless in SH3.
            When I played SH3 i was really happy when there was parts without monsters. If there wouldnt be monsters, this game could be good 🙂
            Pure horror would be better for SH. Scary music, scary places but nothing really happening. Only fear that something can happen.
            You played Project Zero? I played Projcet Zero 3. The best horror game I ever played.
            I played Resident2,3,4,5, Silent hill(Yes only a few hours), Project zero, a little Alan wake(Awesome gameplay), Dead space demo(fantastic shooter) and others horrors as well.

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            Alan wake is badass

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            🙂 I only played for minutes but gameplay is fantastic! Evades, that trick with flashlight to blind enemies and make them weak, shooting etc great game.

          • Gatsu

            Gameplay don’t make a game bad imo ^^. Look at Metal Gear Solid 1 for example and how limited it is.

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Sorry but in my opinion if gameplay sucks nothing can save it. Its game. a game! If I want great story im reading a book, if I want fantastic graphic I watch Transformers, if I want the best animation Im watching anime, if I want the best music Im listening radio(here I would have to write anime too but You know what I mean.) etc.
            Gameplay is the most important thing for games.
            That right there are games with great stories and awesome music but You play them to have fun. Not to watch 30 minutes cutscenes.
            MGS1 gameplay is great. Awesome stealth and it is really big for a PSX game. There are many different things in the MGS1. Like button mashing in torture scene, or rope climbing/going down, riding with Meryl in a car in last scene etc

          • Gatsu

            No need to be sorry, I understand your point :). The 3 things I’ve always loved most in games is story, characters and music because they give me the feels <3.

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Thats right 🙂
            Who cares if You have graphic from Uncharted 4 if gameplay is like in legendary E.T. 🙂

      • ADAMJENSEN13

        Im not playing games since PS4 release. Im a veteran I would say. Im playing games since I remember. Im playing games since first playstation.
        I know what a good game is from just looking at it.
        And to hospital moment I played for 5 hours so that is really long.
        And for me it was a bad game. Really bad game!

    • Gatsu

      Silent Hill 2 and 3 are some of the best horror games imo. How was SH3 really bad? If it’s graphics you mean, yes it’s not the same. But they managed to capture the psychological horror feeling, with the creepy music, monsters and dark areas etc.

      I played PT couple days ago for fun again and still scare the shit outta me ;). It’s a shame Silent Hills was cancelled indeed, could’ve been something truly amazing.

      • ADAMJENSEN13

        I will tell You why I think Silent Hill 3 is a bad game. No. Not because of the graphic. Graphic was the best thing in that game in my opinion.
        From the begining:

        Voice acting is very bad. Horrible. Shitty!

        Music. I read that Akira Yamaoka is for many people the best music videogames composer but music was bad too. Sounds were bad too.
        Scary? When and where?! Go play Project Zero 3 and You will know what is a horror videogame.
        Gameplay is just shit! Exploration is bad, shooting is not necessary, guns are not necessary, enemies are stupid but with cool design, and when You have a importatant thing like key and when You want to open a door it says You dont have a key and You have to open menu to use it. There was moments I forgot what items I collected so that was the most shitty thing in the game.
        So for me that game is very very bad. My score for this game is 3/10.
        If Silent Hill 3 was that bad I dont think first or second game could be better.
        But hey, thats my opinion. Its great You like them I just shared my opinion.

        • Leguywhodrownedquiet

          The theme of laura says hello

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            ???

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            Theme of Laura

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Oh, I see. 🙂

        • Gatsu

          It’s okey if don’t like same games :). Still, in older games gameplay, voice acting etc can feel bad compared to the high tech games from these days. Because it was different times and different budgets.

          Akira Yamaoka’s music made the game scary imo and that was amazing, some tracks are pretty messed up but it fits to the atmosphere. And the main theme composed by Akira was even used at the end of P.T.

          Gosh I would’ve loved to see him return for SH with Kojima and the others T_T. I wonder if this sadness ever ends argh.

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            You may be right. But MGS1 have great voice acting and there are games today that have horrible voice acting. Like Yakuza1 game in english. WOW! That was horrible man! 🙂
            But there are some games that had better gameplay than games releasing today too.
            I watched PT without music 🙂 Sorry 🙂 I will watch it with music someday.
            Project Zero 3 soundtrack was meeeggaa!!!!!! SCARY!!!! that was awesome music in every way!!!
            Thats a really long 🙂 Im playing games for long too. I remember playing Resident 3 on my psx it was mega scary the year it released:)
            What do You think about Slenderman? Demo is nice but I thought there would be slender in the demo but he didnt appear 🙁
            Slenderman is the best on Youtube. You watched butchykid videos? Hahaha!

          • Gatsu

            Yeah MGS is one of the rare game series that has always had fantastic voice acting :D. I Think I played Project Zero 3 in the past years ago, but can’t remember exactly well.

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            From today games I would choose Resindet evil as one with one greatest acting. RE4,5 and 6 voice acting is Stunning! 🙂
            Gears of war acting is fantastic too. Marcus rules!

            I see. I will check it out sometime 🙂
            In Silent Hill 3 was one sound I like. But it was sonly sound not music. I think it was when monsters appeard. it was nice 🙂
            I played it only to hospital because my disk is broken. I read there are many problems in SH3 in hospital. Loading appears and nothing happening thats why I didnt finished it.
            But graphic is fantastic!

          • Leguywhodrownedquiet

            RE3 was the shit

          • ADAMJENSEN13

            Resident 3? I really dont remember so I cant say 🙂
            But I remember playing remake of the first one on gamecube. Very good game. Great riddles, nice shooting and enemies are not so annoying like in Silent Hill 3.

  • Venom_Sina

    Wise choice.He did exactly what I told a few months ago (you’re welcome,Kojima,lol).Kojima doesn’t have the necessary resources for developing a brand new engine.Plus,they’re on the clock right now,so a developed engine can save a lot of time and money for them.

  • Serpent

    Is it just me or does the render look like FOX Engine?